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	<title>Comments on: Printing police handcuff keys &#8230;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blackbag.nl/?feed=rss2&#038;p=940" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940</link>
	<description>Locks, lockpicking, encryption, RF spectrum and more</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 07 Sep 2010 16:37:44 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Jean-Claude</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-181191</link>
		<dc:creator>Jean-Claude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Nov 2009 06:49:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-181191</guid>
		<description>@Ray: Granted, a hinged Medeco behind my back is something I&#039;ve yet to accomplish, but we all can dream.  ASP has some prototypes floating around, with almost no metal and everything ultrasonically welded, then polished obliterating the seam.  Shrug.  These are ideas, mind you, but y&#039;alls input are always welcome.

On another note, anyone seen these new 13 pin tubulars? Or am I just old?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ray: Granted, a hinged Medeco behind my back is something I&#8217;ve yet to accomplish, but we all can dream.  ASP has some prototypes floating around, with almost no metal and everything ultrasonically welded, then polished obliterating the seam.  Shrug.  These are ideas, mind you, but y&#8217;alls input are always welcome.</p>
<p>On another note, anyone seen these new 13 pin tubulars? Or am I just old?</p>
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		<title>By: Ray</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-181183</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 08:29:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-181183</guid>
		<description>@Jean-Claude: we go after the medeco for fun, not because we have to.

The attack on the handcuff you&#039;re talking about is well known, especially after I presented it at the HOPE conference last year:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5-c5OA0-9U
I&#039;ve already discussed ways to prevent that with people commercially involved (Peerless also tried that on their own and failed with the XJ model...), if you&#039;re interested just contact me, email is written on my site linked above... 

Oh, and to all the people who took so much interest in this: thanks! It was fun at HAR and also quite some afterwards...

And to the critics: this never was inteded to be evil, and it isn&#039;t. The key itself never was a secret, even though they won&#039;t sell it there are good pictures of it on the internet, even on police-equipment shops.So the dutch police always had to know there&#039;s a chance of someone having that key. I just reminded them of that... My intention mainly was to show a reprap can print actual keys - that to my knowledge never has been done before and I was surprised myself how good it finally worked. Choosing a handcuff key just seemed logical after all the talks I held about opening those...

Greetings,
Ray
http://save.y.nu

P.S: Regarding the video linked above: that&#039;s actually part 3/3 of the first version of my talk, held in New York mid 2008. For people who understand german I&#039;d recomnend the longer version I held at the 25C3 in Berlin, &quot;Handschellen Hacken&quot; which can be found at
http://events.ccc.de/congress/2008/wiki/Conference_Recordings</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Jean-Claude: we go after the medeco for fun, not because we have to.</p>
<p>The attack on the handcuff you&#8217;re talking about is well known, especially after I presented it at the HOPE conference last year:<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5-c5OA0-9U" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5-c5OA0-9U</a><br />
I&#8217;ve already discussed ways to prevent that with people commercially involved (Peerless also tried that on their own and failed with the XJ model&#8230;), if you&#8217;re interested just contact me, email is written on my site linked above&#8230; </p>
<p>Oh, and to all the people who took so much interest in this: thanks! It was fun at HAR and also quite some afterwards&#8230;</p>
<p>And to the critics: this never was inteded to be evil, and it isn&#8217;t. The key itself never was a secret, even though they won&#8217;t sell it there are good pictures of it on the internet, even on police-equipment shops.So the dutch police always had to know there&#8217;s a chance of someone having that key. I just reminded them of that&#8230; My intention mainly was to show a reprap can print actual keys &#8211; that to my knowledge never has been done before and I was surprised myself how good it finally worked. Choosing a handcuff key just seemed logical after all the talks I held about opening those&#8230;</p>
<p>Greetings,<br />
Ray<br />
<a href="http://save.y.nu" rel="nofollow">http://save.y.nu</a></p>
<p>P.S: Regarding the video linked above: that&#8217;s actually part 3/3 of the first version of my talk, held in New York mid 2008. For people who understand german I&#8217;d recomnend the longer version I held at the 25C3 in Berlin, &#8220;Handschellen Hacken&#8221; which can be found at<br />
<a href="http://events.ccc.de/congress/2008/wiki/Conference_Recordings" rel="nofollow">http://events.ccc.de/congress/2008/wiki/Conference_Recordings</a></p>
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		<title>By: Jean-Claude</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-181180</link>
		<dc:creator>Jean-Claude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 11:34:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-181180</guid>
		<description>I find it ironic that the EU, which has managed to ban Danish cartoons, German video games, and all sorts of things that may offend others, would have such a following protecting those who use handcuff keys for ill will.

Here in the States, unless you&#039;re in the military or law enforcement, leave your fuzzy handcuff keys at home.
Or in your LockCon case.

I&#039;m actually doing some commercial work on handcuffs right now, if anybody&#039;s interested.
There&#039;s no reason to go after the Medeco if you can exploit the cuffs.

Sink + Offender == FAIL</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find it ironic that the EU, which has managed to ban Danish cartoons, German video games, and all sorts of things that may offend others, would have such a following protecting those who use handcuff keys for ill will.</p>
<p>Here in the States, unless you&#8217;re in the military or law enforcement, leave your fuzzy handcuff keys at home.<br />
Or in your LockCon case.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m actually doing some commercial work on handcuffs right now, if anybody&#8217;s interested.<br />
There&#8217;s no reason to go after the Medeco if you can exploit the cuffs.</p>
<p>Sink + Offender == FAIL</p>
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		<title>By: Tripp</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-181089</link>
		<dc:creator>Tripp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Oct 2009 06:23:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-181089</guid>
		<description>@Jaakko Fagerlund:
Well if someone was inclined to... they could start a profile on that address manually or just run it through a program like Maltego and do some further manual scraping to further build a profile on you. Follow that up with some social engineering on a forum or contact you on similar interests.... say dictionary.com or tut.fi for example....
That is why you should protect your email adress.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Jaakko Fagerlund:<br />
Well if someone was inclined to&#8230; they could start a profile on that address manually or just run it through a program like Maltego and do some further manual scraping to further build a profile on you. Follow that up with some social engineering on a forum or contact you on similar interests&#8230;. say dictionary.com or tut.fi for example&#8230;.<br />
That is why you should protect your email adress.</p>
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		<title>By: Jaakko Fagerlund</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180886</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaakko Fagerlund</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 16:50:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180886</guid>
		<description>anon said: &quot;BrSSnKl, posting your email address in a public place is very dangerous. &quot;

Give me one reason why it is so dangerous? Here is mine: einstein@mbnet.fi and all you can do with it is to A) send me mail and B) get some spammer interested. There is this thing called spam filter, which already trashes 90% of all incoming messages on the spot, so that ain&#039;t a problem :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>anon said: &#8220;BrSSnKl, posting your email address in a public place is very dangerous. &#8221;</p>
<p>Give me one reason why it is so dangerous? Here is mine: <a href="mailto:einstein@mbnet.fi">einstein@mbnet.fi</a> and all you can do with it is to A) send me mail and B) get some spammer interested. There is this thing called spam filter, which already trashes 90% of all incoming messages on the spot, so that ain&#8217;t a problem :)</p>
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		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180847</link>
		<dc:creator>steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 12:34:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180847</guid>
		<description>it was not the key that was the trouble...

it was the anarchy and shooting flames, that was the real clincher.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>it was not the key that was the trouble&#8230;</p>
<p>it was the anarchy and shooting flames, that was the real clincher.</p>
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		<title>By: edwin</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180845</link>
		<dc:creator>edwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 10:16:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180845</guid>
		<description>Dat heb je heel goed gedaan 
Een gat in de markt ,zijn ze al te koop.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dat heb je heel goed gedaan<br />
Een gat in de markt ,zijn ze al te koop.</p>
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		<title>By: Big kate</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180841</link>
		<dc:creator>Big kate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 08:09:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180841</guid>
		<description>WARNING. THIS IS GETTING SLASHDOTTED!

this article is going viral and making some serious traction.

 I&#039;m still kicking myself that I didn&#039;t go to the session. 

AFAIK this was happening in the LOCKCON 2 space being run by TOOOL http://toool.nl/ ?

BTW big shout out to all the core team who ran HAR2009, thanks for 2 fantastic weeks!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WARNING. THIS IS GETTING SLASHDOTTED!</p>
<p>this article is going viral and making some serious traction.</p>
<p> I&#8217;m still kicking myself that I didn&#8217;t go to the session. </p>
<p>AFAIK this was happening in the LOCKCON 2 space being run by TOOOL <a href="http://toool.nl/" rel="nofollow">http://toool.nl/</a> ?</p>
<p>BTW big shout out to all the core team who ran HAR2009, thanks for 2 fantastic weeks!!!!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: anon</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180821</link>
		<dc:creator>anon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 13:55:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180821</guid>
		<description>BrSSnKl, posting your email address in a public place is very dangerous. I just came here from reddit but who knows this could be posted on digg...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BrSSnKl, posting your email address in a public place is very dangerous. I just came here from reddit but who knows this could be posted on digg&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: CabFabLab</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180817</link>
		<dc:creator>CabFabLab</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 13:18:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180817</guid>
		<description>Oops, forgot the URL of the Flickr photo set:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/cabfablab/sets/72157621941395455/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oops, forgot the URL of the Flickr photo set:<br />
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/cabfablab/sets/72157621941395455/" rel="nofollow">http://www.flickr.com/photos/cabfablab/sets/72157621941395455/</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: CabFabLab</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180816</link>
		<dc:creator>CabFabLab</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 13:18:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180816</guid>
		<description>We printed 2 versions when we got back from HAR2009, check out our Flickr photoset (near the end) for some pictures of the 3D printed keys. Our Dimension FDM machine has a better layer resolution in the Z direction, so the key that was built vertically has more detail and it seems to be a bit stronger. 

With metal 3D printing techniques becoming more accessible and affordable it would be possible to copy almost any key.. all you need is a good high resolution picture and a scale reference to build a virtual model which can be printed on demand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We printed 2 versions when we got back from HAR2009, check out our Flickr photoset (near the end) for some pictures of the 3D printed keys. Our Dimension FDM machine has a better layer resolution in the Z direction, so the key that was built vertically has more detail and it seems to be a bit stronger. </p>
<p>With metal 3D printing techniques becoming more accessible and affordable it would be possible to copy almost any key.. all you need is a good high resolution picture and a scale reference to build a virtual model which can be printed on demand.</p>
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		<title>By: BrSSnKl</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180811</link>
		<dc:creator>BrSSnKl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 10:03:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180811</guid>
		<description>send it to baris.josh@gmail.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>send it to <a href="mailto:baris.josh@gmail.com">baris.josh@gmail.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: BrSSnKl</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180810</link>
		<dc:creator>BrSSnKl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 10:02:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180810</guid>
		<description>can you send me a sketch up version of this so i can know sizes of it and build a wooden one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>can you send me a sketch up version of this so i can know sizes of it and build a wooden one.</p>
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		<title>By: bart</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180809</link>
		<dc:creator>bart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 09:33:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180809</guid>
		<description>Hey, we have Ray\&#039;s fingerprints now, too! *runs to 3d printer*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, we have Ray\&#8217;s fingerprints now, too! *runs to 3d printer*</p>
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		<title>By: tOM Trottier</title>
		<link>http://blackbag.nl/?p=940&#038;cpage=1#comment-180807</link>
		<dc:creator>tOM Trottier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Sep 2009 07:21:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blackbag.nl/?p=940#comment-180807</guid>
		<description>The problem was it was concealed. He should have a shorter necklace with a gold-plated key.

tOM</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem was it was concealed. He should have a shorter necklace with a gold-plated key.</p>
<p>tOM</p>
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